Traumatized little Fred

[Little_star]

Good posts, fairy 

Margrethe and Henrik seem to be the type of parents who are so wrapped up in themselves that their children do not get a look in. If it wasn't part of Margrethe's job description to have kids then I think she and Henrik would have been happy with just each other.

[Maria]

it's so obvious that henrik is a doting grandfather and that his grandkids adore him. that doesn't fit at all with not loving children.

Considering that Fred has seemed misrable for long periods in his childhood and youth, I think it's quite fair to say that Henrik is far from the model parent - regardless of whether he loved Fred and Joachim as children or not. Also it's ALWAYS easier being a grandparent than a parent. 

[Cara]

it's so obvious that henrik is a doting grandfather and that his grandkids adore him. that doesn't fit at all with not loving children.

Considering that Fred has seemed misrable for long periods in his childhood and youth, I think it's quite fair to say that Henrik is far from the model parent - regardless of whether he loved Fred and Joachim as children or not. Also it's ALWAYS easier being a grandparent than a parent. 

i completely agree on it being always easier being a grandparent! 

my point was not that henrik was a model parent but that, looking at his relationship with his grandkids, he cannot be labeled as not loving children.

whether he was a model parent or not is a different debate.

it’s obvious that henrik’s toughness was not appropriate for fred (not sure if it was also the case with jokke?).
i remember seeing the sequence where he told a crying fred to go back on his horse heartbreaking (to paraphrase fairy henrik was right in essence but wrong in how he managed it).

at the same time i share fairy’s view that there’s a difference between was what seen as appropriate, if not right, back then and today.

[Maria]

it's so obvious that henrik is a doting grandfather and that his grandkids adore him. that doesn't fit at all with not loving children.

Considering that Fred has seemed misrable for long periods in his childhood and youth, I think it's quite fair to say that Henrik is far from the model parent - regardless of whether he loved Fred and Joachim as children or not. Also it's ALWAYS easier being a grandparent than a parent. 

i completely agree on it being always easier being a grandparent! 

my point was not that henrik was a model parent but that, looking at his relationship with his grandkids, he cannot be labeled as not loving children.

whether he was a model parent or not is a different debate.

it’s obvious that henrik’s toughness was not appropriate for fred (not sure if it was also the case with jokke?).
i remember seeing the sequence where he told a crying fred to go back on his horse heartbreaking (to paraphrase fairy henrik was right in essence but wrong in how he managed it).

at the same time i share fairy’s view that there’s a difference between was what seen as appropriate, if not right, back then and today.

Henrik has always been the odd man out in Denmark. Also back then. I think his methods of upbringing - I guess we should say their methods really - weren't seen as normal or appropriate. For instance when the kids were shipped off to a French boarding school.

[fairy]

Perhaps Denmark was even less strict in bringing up children back then?
Shipping off children to boarding schools, telling them to stop whining and get back on the horse or ski or whatever, telling them to "pull youself together or else I'll box your ears" were things that were quite common in the nick of woods were I hail from.
I don't condone mistreatment, but I think Fred gets a lot of pass. First his father messed him up and then his wife. Poor chap never seemed to have a chance.

[Maria]

Perhaps Denmark was even less strict in bringing up children back then?
Shipping off children to boarding schools, telling them to stop whining and get back on the horse or ski or whatever, telling them to "pull youself together or else I'll box your ears" were things that were quite common in the nick of woods were I hail from.
I don't condone mistreatment, but I think Fred gets a lot of pass. First his father messed him up and then his wife. Poor chap never seemed to have a chance.

I think it depends on what circles you lived in, but it's my impression that many Danes were quite relaxed about parenting at that time (we probably still are..) Hippies, free love and such. Here comes the Frenchman with his silksocks, strict upbringing and obvious use of brute force. No, I don't think Henrik was much unstood back then either.

Fred hasn't had it easy IMO. I understand why he has issues. I don't understand why he doesn't do anything about them though. I guess it's easier blaming everyone else, than doing something youself..

[getafix]

Fred hasn't had it easy IMO. I understand why he has issues. I don't understand why he doesn't do anything about them though. I guess it's easier blaming everyone else, than doing something youself.. [/quote]

Floppy frodo has worked out long ago that being passive/aggressive works in his favour with anyone concerened. No need to change then, no need to change now. They feel guilty; he gets away with what he wanted to..works well all around 

G

[PeDe]

Fairy is right, I'm from that generation as well. Spanking was not a crime and used pretty liberal in my time. I was more than once on the receiving end on this one by my father. My mom on the other hand never raised her hand, or her voice, but when she looked at me a certain way, dayum, it was on.

I know that my parents on the other hand were treated even more harshly. So, every generation loosens up, I guess, analyzes the one before, learns and tries to make it better. I don't condone beating and psychological terror (had too much experience when working with severely damaged children) but what I cannot stand either are entitled, whiny, rude brats - doesn't matter which social class they come from. Because 95% of the time their behaviour will carry over into adulthood. And I swear when I encounter people like that, I have to walk away before i give myself an aneurism.

There were children being brought up in worse conditions than Fred's, who ended up being hardworking, accountable and decent adults - all over the world. So, for him to play the "pitty me, because I had a hard childhood" game doesn't roll with me. On that one I call BS. I'd say, stop your goddamn snivelling, roll up your sleeves, and GROW THE EFF UP ALREADY.

Everyone of us carries his/her own difficulties from growing up. Some have scratches left, some deep seated scars. But from what I gather we work hard, are accountable for our behaviour, and raise our children to be functioning parts of society. Not only carrying our own history, but the history of our forefathers, as will our children.

/rant over.

[Cloaked]

PeDe, good comment.

[getafix]

Peeds, here's one  for your rant 

Phantastik post 

G

[BWpunisher]

Fairy is right, I'm from that generation as well. Spanking was not a crime and used pretty liberal in my time. I was more than once on the receiving end on this one by my father. My mom on the other hand never raised her hand, or her voice, but when she looked at me a certain way, dayum, it was on.

I know that my parents on the other hand were treated even more harshly. So, every generation loosens up, I guess, analyzes the one before, learns and tries to make it better. I don't condone beating and psychological terror (had too much experience when working with severely damaged children) but what I cannot stand either are entitled, whiny, rude brats - doesn't matter which social class they come from. Because 95% of the time their behaviour will carry over into adulthood. And I swear when I encounter people like that, I have to walk away before i give myself an aneurism.

There were children being brought up in worse conditions than Fred's, who ended up being hardworking, accountable and decent adults - all over the world. So, for him to play the "pitty me, because I had a hard childhood" game doesn't roll with me. On that one I call BS. I'd say, stop your goddamn snivelling, roll up your sleeves, and GROW THE EFF UP ALREADY.

Everyone of us carries his/her own difficulties from growing up. Some have scratches left, some deep seated scars. But from what I gather we work hard, are accountable for our behaviour, and raise our children to be functioning parts of society. Not only carrying our own history, but the history of our forefathers, as will our children.

/rant over.

That's what I have said over and over again about Fred. You just put it waaaaaay more eloquently than I ever have/could. 

[christina01]

I think boarding school is fairly common for aristo kids, Prince Charles was shipped off to several, including one in Australia. My parents were pretty harsh when we were growing up. My father was extremely strict with my brothers, and I can remember being afraid of them at times. I am not saying this is right at all, but that was deemed fairly normal. I and my siblings were also shipped off to Australia to boarding school for six years (we grew up in New Guinea), and this was considered normal for all of us who grew up there. It was just the way it was. Not sure Fred and his brother would have known much different either.

[Little_star]

PeDe.

Fred's whining about his childhood is absurd IMO.

[whimsicalwriter]

I think boarding school is fairly common for aristo kids, Prince Charles was shipped off to several, including one in Australia. My parents were pretty harsh when we were growing up. My father was extremely strict with my brothers, and I can remember being afraid of them at times. I am not saying this is right at all, but that was deemed fairly normal. I and my siblings were also shipped off to Australia to boarding school for six years (we grew up in New Guinea), and this was considered normal for all of us who grew up there. It was just the way it was. Not sure Fred and his brother would have known much different either.

Boarding schools use to be extremely common for aristo kids. I don't think they are as common now though I can't say for sure. I couldn't imagine going through it myself but many have gone through boarding schools and grew up just fine.

[christina01]

I think boarding school is fairly common for aristo kids, Prince Charles was shipped off to several, including one in Australia. My parents were pretty harsh when we were growing up. My father was extremely strict with my brothers, and I can remember being afraid of them at times. I am not saying this is right at all, but that was deemed fairly normal. I and my siblings were also shipped off to Australia to boarding school for six years (we grew up in New Guinea), and this was considered normal for all of us who grew up there. It was just the way it was. Not sure Fred and his brother would have known much different either.

Boarding schools use to be extremely common for aristo kids. I don't think they are as common now though I can't say for sure. I couldn't imagine going through it myself but many have gone through boarding schools and grew up just fine.

They can be a lonely place, but also terrific fun. Many memories for sure