Queen Camilla or Princess Consort?

[BessieWallis Warfield]

That was a great post, Tatty!   

I completely agree that women always have to wear the scarlet letter.  Charles will be crowned King, despite his infidelity.  As did how many other men?
I'd venture that far more crowned kings have been unfaithful than not.  But they are crowned without question.  Why should Camilla wear a scarlet letter rather than a crown?  Charles was equally culpable in the relationship, perhaps more so as he was the one who took the vows. 

Either crown them both or oust them both.  Otherwise it's sexist. 

P.S.  If Charles insists Camilla is crowned, it will enrage a good deal of the public, but it's that the very same members of the public who want to see Diana's son on the throne.  So they'll rant and rave and grin and bear it for the time being.  So I think he'll get his way in the end. 

[Maria]

P.S.  If Charles insists Camilla is crowned, it will enrage a good deal of the public, but it's that the very same members of the public who want to see Diana's son on the throne.  So they'll rant and rave and grin and bear it for the time being.  So I think he'll get his way in the end. 

I wonder if Camilla actually wants to be crowned queen. She doesn't strike me as someone navie: I think she knows very well how people feel about her. She's used to be hated but I don't think she's looking for more hate as it is.

[Princess Tia]

If they indeed are serious about changing the laws of primogeniture so that the first born child inherits the throne, this would be the perfect time to also change the designation of the spouse of that child.  

Old law:  first born son is reigning king/spouse is Queen Consort
              only daughters in the family the first born is reigning queen, eg. Eliz./spouse is styled Prince
              Consort

New law:  first born child is reigning king or queen; spouse is styled Princess/Prince Consort

Camilla could then graciously request to be called Princess Consort (in accordance with the new laws), winning maybe a wee bit of favor with the people.  They could hire a PR team to really pump that idea.

That could possibly start a trend for some of the other countries in Europe that have already changed their laws of primogeniture.  Mary, Letizia, Maxima, would then forever be known as Princess.  They would change from Crown Princess to Princess Consort when their husband takes the throne.

[just a serf]

Camilla is very pragmatic and she would never go against something Charles wanted.

[Countess of Cows]

i agree,  i'm not especially fond of camilla, but she doesn't seem pushy or power grasper, i'm not at all sure she wouldn't have been happier staying his mistress at her farm, playing with her grandkids and doing what the heck she wants and answering to nobody (including chuck) 

i'm quite sure he's not an easy person to live with or deal with, very spoiled, very "entitled", very difficult about getting his own way.  what a nightmare for a husband.  i saw him coldly and cruelly treat her in the church at the wedding.  i'll bet chuck is a mean control freak when he wants to be 

 does anyone really get used to be hated?  stiff upper lip and all that, but to spend the rest of your life hearing people boo when appearing would be awful IMO

[just a serf]

i saw him coldly and cruelly treat her in the church at the wedding. 

What did he do?

[Countess of Cows]

when they got out of the car the crowd booed, and you could tell he was annoyed.  when they got into the church, camilla wasn't sure of where to stand and turned to him for help, he coldly ignored her and turned away, she looked very vulnerable and if i remember correctly sad and stunned.  the minister ended up taking her arm and showing her where to stand.  i watched it LIVE, it was cut out of the later "live" broadcast but i remember very clearly actually feeling sorry for her and that doesn't come naturally 

[Maria]

when they got out of the car the crowd booed, and you could tell he was annoyed.  when they got into the church, camilla wasn't sure of where to stand and turned to him for help, he coldly ignored her and turned away, she looked very vulnerable and if i remember correctly sad and stunned.  the minister ended up taking her arm and showing her where to stand.  i watched it LIVE, it was cut out of the later "live" broadcast but i remember very clearly actually feeling sorry for her and that doesn't come naturally 

At the time I felt that it was a hard day for all of them because Diana wasn't there. I think you would have to have a heart of stone to not fell sad about the mother of the groom being there and I think it was hard for Charles especially, because no matter what I believe he would have wished that Diana could be there. So poor Camilla was doomed in a way - cranky, sad husband (IMO) and literally every single person watching wishing or thinking about Diana being there. Can't have been easy for her.

[Lolita]

 does anyone really get used to be hated? stiff upper lip and all that, but to spend the rest of your life hearing people boo when appearing would be awful IMO

I don't think so. I really feel sorry for her. She made a mistake, but she paid for it massively. Most people get forgiveness but Camilla is still villified. I do think she would have preferred a simple life with Charlie. That said, just being princess consort won't stop the boos. She's the wife of the future king, so she should become Queen consort like the other wives of kings. After all she wasn't the only person in this relationship to have committed adultery.

I'm not sure if her love to him was worth this hate. Can the love of a man really make you forget all this hate and humiliations?

[Lady Alice]

when they got out of the car the crowd booed, and you could tell he was annoyed.  when they got into the church, camilla wasn't sure of where to stand and turned to him for help, he coldly ignored her and turned away, she looked very vulnerable and if i remember correctly sad and stunned.  the minister ended up taking her arm and showing her where to stand.  i watched it LIVE, it was cut out of the later "live" broadcast but i remember very clearly actually feeling sorry for her and that doesn't come naturally 

At the time I felt that it was a hard day for all of them because Diana wasn't there. I think you would have to have a heart of stone to not fell sad about the mother of the groom being there and I think it was hard for Charles especially, because no matter what I believe he would have wished that Diana could be there. So poor Camilla was doomed in a way - cranky, sad husband (IMO) and literally every single person watching wishing or thinking about Diana being there. Can't have been easy for her.

Oh yes, and the queen was quite cold to her too. I went and looked for the clips after I watched the wedding live because I couldn't believe what I had watched. They *were* on YouTube, but it wouldn't surprise me if somehow they disappeared.

[BessieWallis Warfield]

 does anyone really get used to be hated? stiff upper lip and all that, but to spend the rest of your life hearing people boo when appearing would be awful IMO

I don't think so. I really feel sorry for her. She made a mistake, but she paid for it massively. Most people get forgiveness but Camilla is still villified. I do think she would have preferred a simple life with Charlie. That said, just being princess consort won't stop the boos. She's the wife of the future king, so she should become Queen consort like the other wives of kings. After all she wasn't the only person in this relationship to have committed adultery.

I'm not sure if her love to him was worth this hate. Can the love of a man really make you forget all this hate and humiliations?

No, in a word.  Being "in love" fades and all relationships are vulnerable to outside forces.  I don't know how she manages it, frankly.  I think she always puts on a brave face. 

Adultery is not right, but it IS rampant.  I'd love to know who is booing her and what glass houses they live in.

[devin22]

 does anyone really get used to be hated? stiff upper lip and all that, but to spend the rest of your life hearing people boo when appearing would be awful IMO

I don't think so. I really feel sorry for her. She made a mistake, but she paid for it massively. Most people get forgiveness but Camilla is still villified. I do think she would have preferred a simple life with Charlie. That said, just being princess consort won't stop the boos. She's the wife of the future king, so she should become Queen consort like the other wives of kings. After all she wasn't the only person in this relationship to have committed adultery.

I'm not sure if her love to him was worth this hate. Can the love of a man really make you forget all this hate and humiliations?

At times I do feel sorry for her. But she did make choices and with those choices comes consequences. I wonder if Diana had lived and continued to find happiness would Camilla be more accepted? IMO if Diana was alive and the public saw how good their relationship became. Maybe some of the resentment directed towards him would be gone.

[Countess of Cows]

i agree Devin, if Diana were alive and they were "friends" perhaps things would be different.  i also think chuck isn't that lovable, a lot of the anomosity comes from the way he treated Diana, if people loved and admired him, some of that would be allowed camilla.  i don't think (i don't know) people like him and that's a problem for everybody.  it's very interesting how all of sudden, charles and camilla are front and center......i wonder if the plan will work (somehow i doubt it)  i have to give camilla points for giving it a good show, she always seems engaged and smiling, she's trying really hard....but in the end it comes down to the feelings about HIM jMO

looking back on some of DoE gaffes and glaring insults to people, he was always kinda given a pass, the outrage passed (same with worthless andy) IMO because of the high regard for the queen, when she's gone, all bets are off IMO

[esther angeline]

Great posts Tatty, Fairy, Countess of Cows, Lolita , Princess Tia   

I have never much liked Camilla, too much nostalgia for Diana.  Yet, I have to give Camilla  for her sense duty, pleasantness, good sport conduct when out with Charles.  I agree with others that she would not have ideally wanted to be in the public life as a member of the BRF.  It has actually subjected her to ongoing hate, etc.  The best she can ever hope for is indifference which is the beginning of the death knell for the Crown.

I think that is why the Queen has them out front now, while she is alive.  She is hoping that some of her "Diamond Dust" will settle on them and secure the Monarchy into the future, at least until William can ascend.

There is no innocents amongst Charles, Camilla or Diana.  Diana just had the benefit of a ideal princess image and was a master of public relations.  And this is coming from a Diana admirer.

[rs55]

   he is a big brat, not very loveable and now that he's pushed his luck and married her, deserves the low rating.  JMO whether we like it or not (and i don't) she will be queen NO MATTER what title or how they try to hide it.  it's terrible but i really hope the queen out lives him JMO JMO he will never get the respect or affection that the queen inspires NEVER especially with her beside him.

i think it's telling they try not to be without the queen or wills in public, i think those boo's really shook him and he does his best to not let it happen again, when she's queen i see it getting worse and the crown being vulnerable, i seriously have doubts Will will be king, i think it'll really end with QEII. JMO
[/quote]

Why would anyone wish such a thing on the Queen?!  No parent should ever have to outlive their child!