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Author Topic: Wessex Family  (Read 645741 times)
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Gemsheal

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« Reply #2385 on: November 09, 2021, 09:20:31 PM »

Whenever I see a photo of Louise now, the following words come to my mind:  "... she need(s) no royal title to continue to generate her particular brand of magic."   

She seems to have grown into a very nice young girl, quiet and dependable and I hope she will forego any "HRH Princess Louise of ..." nonsense.   

 
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« Reply #2386 on: November 10, 2021, 12:00:05 AM »

My other thought is that in William's generation, other than the buggered off one, there is only one male entitled to HRH who could pass it down. that being James Severn. How much smaller does it need to be?
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Oh_Caroline

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« Reply #2387 on: November 10, 2021, 12:35:34 AM »

My other thought is that in William's generation, other than the buggered off one, there is only one male entitled to HRH who could pass it down. that being James Severn. How much smaller does it need to be?

James can't pass down his HRH as his children will be great-grandchildren of a sovereign.  Only the peerages (and associated courtesy titles) will pass down through his male line descendants.  At this point with James and Louise having but not using it's only really Archie and Lili who are up for debate though they will automatically be HRH Prince(ss) from the moment Charles becomes king so any changes he makes would require stripping not denying as the press tries to claim.

The dilemma really comes from both the lack of consistence and the need to provide for gender equality going forward.  IMO the BRF either needs pick from...

all children and grandchild of a sovereign or future sovereign as HRH Prince(ss) from birth and children of an HRH Prince(ss) as Lord/Lady
  • HRH--Everyone who has one with Louise and James using their's plus Peter, Zara, Archie, & Lili
  • Lord/Lady--the other great-grandkids...Savannah, Isla, Mia, Lena, August, Lucas, & Sienna

limiting HRH Prince(ss) to only the children of a sovereign or future sovereign with other grandchildren being Lord/Lady
  • HRH--Charles, Anne, Andrew, Edward, William, Harry, George, Charlotte, & Louis
  • Lord/Lady--Peter, Zara, Beatrice, Eugenie, Louise, James, Archie, & Lili

They also need to make clear that while no one is being retired against their will in future only future sovereigns will be working royals with everyone else being raised to work real jobs.  Titles are titles only and has no bearing on working status.
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Duchess of Verona

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« Reply #2388 on: November 10, 2021, 12:50:24 AM »

How so? James at 18 has the right to be HRH Prince James of Wessex (or Ed depending on fate). If he chose to be HRH Prince James, his children would be HRH. Other than that it's just the Dumpster Fire and William who would be able to pass it down. That's not a lot.
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Oh_Caroline

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« Reply #2389 on: November 10, 2021, 01:06:55 AM »

How so? James at 18 has the right to be HRH Prince James of Wessex (or Ed depending on fate). If he chose to be HRH Prince James, his children would be HRH. Other than that it's just the Dumpster Fire and William who would be able to pass it down. That's not a lot.

HRH isn't hereditary.  The current LPs limit HRH to the children of a sovereign, the grandchildren of a sovereign, and the children of the eldest living son of the Prince of Wales...James's children will, regardless of his style, be great-grandchildren of a sovereign and therefore will not have an HRH.  Regardless of what James does his eldest son will one day be His Grace The Duke of Edinburgh if all goes to plan or The Right Honourable The Earl of Wessex if things don't.  Much like how none of the children of the current Dukes of Kent and Gloucester and of Prince Michael of Kent have HRH as while the princes are grandchildren of GV their children are great-grandchildren of GV.

Archie and Lili will, if all goes well, one day be grandchildren of a sovereign and therefore under current LPs automatically HRH.  Archie's children as male-line great-grandchildren will not and instead his eldest son will one day be His Grace The Duke of Sussex.

George and Louis's children will, if all goes well, one day be grandchildren of a sovereign and therefore under current LPs automatically HRH but Louis's grandchildren will be male-line great-grandchildren so they won't. 

Lili and Charlotte's children will currently be nothing since they're girls and there's currently no gender equality...much like how Peter, Zara, August, and Sienna have no titles or styles regardless of their degree of relation to a sovereign.

Though like I said limiting titles is largely a PR exercise without addressing the bigger issues...lack of consistency, need for gender equality, and need to stop connecting titles and working status as titles are only meant to indicate degree of relation.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2021, 01:19:31 AM by Oh_Caroline » Logged
Grand Duchess Zenobia

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« Reply #2390 on: November 10, 2021, 01:37:10 AM »

What about Archie and Lili,if Charles will not become the next king, but William? Will they get the HRH or not?
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Oh_Caroline

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« Reply #2391 on: November 10, 2021, 01:41:13 AM »

What about Archie and Lili,if Charles will not become the next king, but William? Will they get the HRH or not?


To be an HRH you must be or have been either a child of a sovereign, a grandchild of a sovereign, or a child of the eldest living son a The Prince of Wales.
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Badger

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« Reply #2392 on: November 10, 2021, 02:27:14 AM »

They can always request a Royal Warrant of Precedence which would grant them the same style and precedence they would have had had their father or grandfather not died before succeeding to the title. 
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luvcharles

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« Reply #2393 on: November 10, 2021, 03:34:33 AM »

How so? James at 18 has the right to be HRH Prince James of Wessex (or Ed depending on fate). If he chose to be HRH Prince James, his children would be HRH. Other than that it's just the Dumpster Fire and William who would be able to pass it down. That's not a lot.

The children of HRH The Duke of Gloucester (formerly known as HRH PRINCE Richard of Gloucester son of THIRD son of George V) are known as the Earl of Ulster, Lady Davina and Lady Rose i.e. they aren't royal but take their titles/styles as the children of a Duke. As Edward is also the THIRD son of a monarch the Duke of Gloucester and the styling of his children are the prefect example of what would be the case for James' children.

The children of the FOURTH son of George V are also HRHs - The Duke of Kent, Prince Michael of Kent and Princess Alexandra. Again the children are styled as the Earl of St Andrews, Lady Helen and Lord Nicholas (Duke of Kent's children), Lady Gabriella and Lord Frederick (Prince Michael's children - his children as styled as the children of a Duke according to the 1917 Letters Patent of George V that gave the right of Lord/Lady to male line great-grandchildren of a sovereign) and plain Marina and James for Princess Alexandra's children as the children of a girl.
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« Reply #2394 on: November 11, 2021, 12:55:13 AM »

If Princess Charlotte of Cambridge marries a Prince with the style of HRH, would not their children have the style of HRH? The HRH would come due to their father, not because Charlotte is the daughter of King William V.
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Oh_Caroline

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« Reply #2395 on: November 11, 2021, 01:03:16 AM »

If Princess Charlotte of Cambridge marries a Prince with the style of HRH, would not their children have the style of HRH? The HRH would come due to their father, not because Charlotte is the daughter of King William V.

It depends on what country he husband is from.  Some countries give titles according to degree of relation to the monarch while others grant titles to legitimate male line descendants of approved marriages.  And some who grant titles give different ones to different degrees of relation.
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« Reply #2396 on: November 12, 2021, 09:56:51 PM »

I'm kind of bummed they didn't release an "official 18th birthday portrait" for Louise.  I know Snowdon isn't around to do it, but still...  It seems as if they didn't do anything for the milestone, and I do think something should be released to the public.  Doesn't have to be anything OTT like the Yorks' big party years ago.
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« Reply #2397 on: November 13, 2021, 09:57:12 PM »

Festival of Remembrance

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luvcharles

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« Reply #2398 on: November 14, 2021, 12:33:02 PM »

I'm kind of bummed they didn't release an "official 18th birthday portrait" for Louise.  I know Snowdon isn't around to do it, but still...  It seems as if they didn't do anything for the milestone, and I do think something should be released to the public.  Doesn't have to be anything OTT like the Yorks' big party years ago.

The only royal who has had a 'big party' for their 18th was Beatrice - due to all the '8s' in her birthday - 8.8.88 so her 18th was marked. Normally it is their 21st that is marked, and not the 18th.
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