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Author Topic: Commoners  (Read 4632 times)
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Pingo
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« on: July 06, 2007, 10:58:40 AM »

If a female commoner who marries a prince or king can be "elevated" to the status of princess / queen, how is it that in these days of gender equality, a male commoner who marries a princess / queen does not recieve similar "elevation"....?
With the exception of the sons in law of the Spanish king, I have seen no other instance of this................any thoughts anyone ?
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fairy

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« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2007, 11:16:34 AM »

There is a huge discussion going on in the Netherlands about that subject.
After several generations of male consorts who were given the  title "prince of te Netherlands" and "Prince Consort", the "elevation" of Princess Maxima to "Queen Consort" is thoroughly debated.
Pretty emanzipated isn't it?
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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2007, 12:14:01 PM »

that's interesting....I guess if "Prince Consort" is good enough for the men, then why not "princess consort" instead of queen...as they plan to do with Camilla (for different reasons)

the commoner men who come to mind that haven t been "elevated"....are Mark Phillips and Tim Laurence (UK)....Stafno Casiraghi, Daniel Ducruet, Adans Peres Lopez (Monaco)......Ari Behn (Norge)...and the  Mr.Quintas Morales (Hellenes)....others ?
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lynda

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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2007, 02:15:54 PM »

Although not a Commoner (but a Royal Prince in his own name) is the most famous of them all.  England's Prince Phillip, and then Queen Victoria's husband Prince Albert.  Both have never gotten the title King.  Just a guess....perhaps the Queen and her Country felt if the husband was given the title King he would just take over all the duties and kinda push the Queen aside to hav e Royal babies.
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lynda

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« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2007, 02:17:14 PM »

What title did Queen Beatrice's husband have?  Queen Ingrid of Denmark? 
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fairy

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« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2007, 02:27:49 PM »

Queen Ingrid of Denmark was the consort of Frederic the IX(?)
Queen Beatrix's husband Claus von Amsberg was the "Prince Consort" as was his father-in-law Bernhard, and Bernhards father-in-law, Henrik.
I think the Netherlands even have a new constitutional law, making the spouse of the monarch a "prince/ss of the Netherlands" only... ( Pretty neew law infact, since, with another part of this new phrasing, little Princess Amalia was enabled to carry the title "Princess of Orange" a title reserved for the male heir apparent till then. ... At least neither, Wilhelmina, nor Juliana or Beatrix as heiress presumptives held the title Princess of Orange..)
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lupina

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« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2007, 02:54:26 PM »

What title did Queen Beatrice's husband have?  Queen Ingrid of Denmark? 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingrid_of_Sweden

lupina
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Ugly Betty

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« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2007, 03:12:06 PM »

Prince Lorenz, the husband of Princess Astrid of Belgium, was made a 'Prince of Belgium' upon his marriage to the princess.
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lynda

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« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2007, 04:16:09 PM »

Has any man that was married to a would be Queen been given the title "King"Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh??
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fairy

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« Reply #9 on: July 06, 2007, 04:57:32 PM »

NO.
The ancient rule is that the mans status is the family level. A woman can be elevated into nobility and even royalty (even though this is a fairly new concept, in earlier times morganatic marriages were quite popular) since her status after marriage is that of her husbands, she automatically can use his titles etc.
However in the same concept a princess marrying a commoner assumes his status afterwards, (though since the girls were allowed to do so and not send into monasteries, while hubby was sent to a certain death, most princesses have kept their title and their husbands their heads)
A king however is per se a ruler, a souvereign King. From the concept the Queen is the consort to the King. History would have made it much easier had the first female ruler used the title "Kingette" or Sheking" or whatever and given her hubby (most likely she never had one, she would have had to cease her power to her husband) the title "Hequeen" "Queener" or for G's sake "Freddy Mercury".
Actually my first initial answer of NO, is not quite correct. I am not sure if there indeed wasn't some powerolic who by marrying the Queen assumed the power. Infact that was one reason, why a female heir presumptive was pretty attractive in medieval times, the allience would have been much stronger.
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Elissa

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« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2007, 05:12:09 PM »

Quote
Has any man that was married to a would be Queen been given the title "King"Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh?Huh??

King François II of France became King of Scotland when he married Mary, Queen of Scots in 1558...and he was still Crown Prince (well the Dauphin, actually!! Yes) in France at that time. But the marriage only lasted eighteen months, until he died in 1560.

Mary'second husband , Lord Henry Darnley, was also proclamed King when they got married, but it was not for a long time either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_II_of_France

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Queen_of_Scots

http://en.wikipedia.org/w...ry_Stuart%2C_Lord_Darnley


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Munkey
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« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2007, 08:57:02 PM »

I'm a commoner!

The original poster's name is Pingo! I LIKE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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dKaren

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« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2007, 09:42:39 AM »

I'm a commoner!

The original poster's name is Pingo! I LIKE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So you are 'commoner' from RB    Tongue.
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Paula
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« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2007, 09:01:59 AM »

In Poland when we have royal family prince/king daughter was a princess wife was a duchess
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« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2007, 11:08:05 AM »

In Poland when we have royal family prince/king daughter was a princess wife was a duchess
Then Poland has never had "Queen consort" title, how about a Queen regent (I'm not sure if Poland has ever had one) and what was the title given to her husband
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