Madeleine & Chris news

[CyrilSebastian]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

[Miss Marple]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

The question is how (emotionally) close he is to them. If I remember right, he went to boarding school from a very young age. So there are no "happy family together" moments usually sibling relationships are based on.

[Maria]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

The question is how (emotionally) close he is to them. If I remember right, he went to boarding school from a very young age. So there are no "happy family together" moments usually sibling relationships are based on.

We have no way of knowing that. IIRC Chris considers himself British so it’s likely where he feels most at home for many reasons. Probably also because of family ties.

They’re not the only family moving internationally because of work. Personally I don’t think Madeleine minds too much being away from Sweden.

[Princess MS]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

The question is how (emotionally) close he is to them. If I remember right, he went to boarding school from a very young age. So there are no "happy family together" moments usually sibling relationships are based on.

We have no way of knowing that. IIRC Chris considers himself British so it’s likely where he feels most at home for many reasons. Probably also because of family ties.

They’re not the only family moving internationally because of work. Personally I don’t think Madeleine minds too much being away from Sweden.

I don’t see Chis outside of US or UK for any extended time.... no idea if he is comfortable in an environment that is not English speaking.... I’m not talking about conversations but in a business sense. I seriously doubt Sweden would work for him in that way ....

[SvenskaSarah]

IIRC the conditions to remain in the LOS (pre 2019) was that any member had to receive their education in Sweden. Was this amended in 2019? It would make sense if it was given Madde's family, but I can't remember if anything was altered re that point. If not it makes the 2019 change seem more of a "huff" reaction by CG that wasn't thought through.

Could any lovely dishers offer some insight?

Re Chris, I think the family are happy where they are, but given his job I think if they were to resettle anywhere in Europe it would either be London again or Switzerland (where Chris also attended school). I know it's morbid of me, but when the time comes for Vic to ascend to the throne (tragedy and abdication permitting) it will be in at least 20 odd years, by which point Estelle and quite possibly Oscar will be working members of the SRF. CP and Hoefia (if she's still around) will be on-hand if necessary; Madde still isn't needed vitally. I know she gets a lot of flak, but I think Madde is very astute and realises her role, the strengths and limitations of it too. Out of all the royals in the world, she seems one of the most aware, and I think Chris helps her to realise that too.

[Oh_Caroline]

I thought that requirement was a constitutional one so something CG doesn’t have any power over.  I feel like it was touch on but very vaguely in 2019 and that really nothing was said either way.

The 2019 changes were pointless, IMO, as all CG had to do was calmly said that only Estelle would be funded in the future as a future sovereign. 

[Märta]

The Swedish act of succession is indeed one of four fundamental laws in Sweden, which CG or no head of state can change (neither GG nor any HoS has the power to change any law in Sweden for that matter...). But a fundamental law requires that the Swedish parlament must adopt two decisions of identical wording with a general election between the two decisions (as with the succession the change per 1979).

To remain in line of succession it is stated (among other things) that the person "should be brought up within the realm". The court has previously said that "the definition of what that means in practical terms is vague". A while after Leonore was born (given that they lived in NY and later London) the court said they had made a decision to interpret it as: "Raised in Sweden from approximately 6 years of age and remain in the Swedish school system throughout her education. She will 'become Swedish', speak the language fluently and graduate from a Swedish highschool."

All the kings grandchildren are still in line of succession despite the changes in 2019 (since the king can't change LoS), so in theory, if Leonore wouldn't move to Sweden now and start her schooling here, she would no longer be in line. But it's all very circumstantial since the scenario of all the things that would need to occur for that to happen is very, very unlikely. With the changes in 2019 however, it was declared from the court that apart from Victoria and her children, the "stripping of Royal Highness Status", the grandkids are not expected to ever work for the crown. Therefor, I believe her schooling would be more a choice of personal choice of the parents rather than driven by regulations.

 

[Oh_Caroline]

I remember that now.  Yeah the definition is vague and there’s really no good way to decide when exactly someone would lose their place based on where they’re being/were raised.

IIRC compulsory education in Sweden starts at age 6 which is why they picked that age.  Of course allowances can be made for starting at 7 what with a pandemic but too far beyond that and a decision will need to be made as to when she (and later her siblings) are removed from the succession.

I wonder if this will trigger a new amendment that would more clearly define what being raised in Sweden means. 

Has the government said anything about this yet or has it all been the court and their opinion on the matter?

[Kristallinchen]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

The question is how (emotionally) close he is to them. If I remember right, he went to boarding school from a very young age. So there are no "happy family together" moments usually sibling relationships are based on.

We have no way of knowing that. IIRC Chris considers himself British so it’s likely where he feels most at home for many reasons. Probably also because of family ties.

They’re not the only family moving internationally because of work. Personally I don’t think Madeleine minds too much being away from Sweden.

I think it's a choice between being away from your family, but able to live your own life or being near your family and being constantly judged of just living a privileged life as Princess.

Madeleine I think misses more her friends and siblings etc...then she does her life as Princess. Though the media says the opposite. I believe, if she'd stayed longer than a few weeks in Sweden the press would again criticize her and she would realize that she's better off a little bit further away.

[Märta]

If Christopher moves to Sweden, would he not be closer geographically to his siblings in Europe?

The question is how (emotionally) close he is to them. If I remember right, he went to boarding school from a very young age. So there are no "happy family together" moments usually sibling relationships are based on.

We have no way of knowing that. IIRC Chris considers himself British so it’s likely where he feels most at home for many reasons. Probably also because of family ties.

They’re not the only family moving internationally because of work. Personally I don’t think Madeleine minds too much being away from Sweden.

I think it's a choice between being away from your family, but able to live your own life or being near your family and being constantly judged of just living a privileged life as Princess.

Madeleine I think misses more her friends and siblings etc...then she does her life as Princess. Though the media says the opposite. I believe, if she'd stayed longer than a few weeks in Sweden the press would again criticize her and she would realize that she's better off a little bit further away.

If she were to stay in Sweden way forward could be to scale up her commitment within Childhood (HQ in Sthlm) and other similar organisations where she has solid experience, competence and dedication to the cause. I'd bet she would be great a great asset as an active board member for instance (a little bit like Tord Magnusson, princess Christina's husband has been throughout the years). That would be a way of creating a new role for her which wouldn't be 'living off the crown' if that's a concern. I think the bigger question is Chris' work and engagement within the finance sector, it's probably harder for him to have Stockholm and Sweden as a base, unless the pandemic has changed the prerequisites for him.

And to end media speculations, the court has confirmed that the family will go back and stay in Florida.

[Miss Marple]

I think if Chris and Madeleine had considered to settle in Sweden permanently he would be fluent or near fluent in Swedish now. I think Madeleine suffered that she could not travel home in the last year and a half and could not see her siblings and parents. Hence the extended stay during the summer. I can't however see them settling in Sweden permanently. They have the problem nearly every spare spare has - they are popular enough to attract public attraction (and always will be, as they are the sibling to the next monarch) but they are too far removed from actually gain much of it. So the disadvantages outweigh the advantages. Obviously that is the rational part of it - she might feel very different about it.

The Swedish press has not been favourable at all towards Madde in years so her kids would grow up confronted with bad headlines about their parents. She might not even do her sister a favour - as we have said before, Sweden is small and currently there are six (!) adults doing royal work which is basically too much already. All other RFs are slimming down for that reason. There is no reason why she should come back as a royal and she is not able to come back as a private person.

If you look to Norway: Harald has slowed down because of his age, Hakoon is not a workhorse. So if we cound Hakoon + Harald as one working person and Sonia as one (MM can't be taken into consideration at all) - there are two working royals and they just manage fine. Same in Denmark: You have Marge + Mary (and occasionally Frodo, when he feels like rolling out of bed) and they are doing fine.